Zompist Bboard Again

rotting bones wrote: ↑Tue Sep 02, 2025 10:35 pm I tried to convince people to support Harris, but I feel like this is going too far in the other direction.

Travis B. wrote: ↑Tue Sep 02, 2025 10:36 am But but but we have to show people how right-wing the Dems are by attacking them at every opportunity (with the fact that the other major party is a bunch of real live fascists being merely an inconvenient sidenote).

Centrist Democrats constantly provoke leftists. They see Republicans as a force of nature they must always capitulate to. Leftists are the actual targets of their ire.

rotting bones wrote: ↑Tue Sep 02, 2025 10:35 pm

Travis B. wrote: ↑Tue Sep 02, 2025 10:36 am To be honest, I really want to ask the people here who said they weren't going to vote for Harris because she wasn't left-wing enough as to whether they are happy now. And yeah, those who didn't vote for Harris over Gaza should at least acknowledge their utter and complete naivete in the very least.

I tried to tell people, but it's human nature to prefer death over disability. Secondly, the American election system is designed to be inconvenient for the poor. It's hard to get voters out in large numbers for candidates they're not enthusiastic about. The answer Harris gave about how her administration would be different from Biden's was not convincing. Also, a lot of people honestly don't understand the concept of voting for a politician they don't support. They're like, "The left was against Gaza, so we opposed them. I don't get it." I don't think a lot of them will ever learn the lesson. The lesson can't be represented within their conceptual framework.

rotting bones wrote: ↑Tue Sep 02, 2025 10:35 pm Besides, if it's worth supporting genocide just to work within existing institutions, that blunts all liberal criticisms of the Soviet Union. Tankies can say the same thing: Since Soviet genocides were endemic to the system as it existed, it was worth looking the other way to prevent the system from failing. If the Soviet genocides argued for opposing Communism, maybe the same argument can be made against a plutocracy that offers voters a choice between left-Nazism and right-Nazism.

Travis B. wrote: ↑Wed Sep 03, 2025 3:11 pm Now Florida is dropping all vaccine requirements for schools. Unfortunately it won't just be the MAGAts themselves who will get infected.

Lērisama wrote: ↑Wed Sep 03, 2025 3:26 pm

Travis B. wrote: ↑Wed Sep 03, 2025 3:11 pm Now Florida is dropping all vaccine requirements for schools. Unfortunately it won't just be the MAGAts themselves who will get infected.

I'd tend not to make political distinctions in wishing people not to get various oh so fun diseases, especially children who don't have a say in their parents beliefs on vaccines. Also, you have vaccine requirements at all? The UK had one for smallpox in the 1800s and has relied on common sense / (later on) the NHS since – finally there's a political trend I from the US I can get on board with. Do you mind sending that back on Nigel Farage's plane? I'm sure he'll appreciate the extra chances to suck up to Trump.

Travis B. wrote: ↑Wed Sep 03, 2025 9:17 am It should be remembered that Trump effectively said that Israel can do whatever it likes with Gaza and now wants to explicitly ethnically cleanse Gaza. The people who opposed Harris over Gaza should have expected this outcome, hence their naivete in somehow thinking Trump would be 'better'.

rotting bones wrote: ↑Wed Sep 03, 2025 4:45 pm

Travis B. wrote: ↑Wed Sep 03, 2025 9:17 am It should be remembered that Trump effectively said that Israel can do whatever it likes with Gaza and now wants to explicitly ethnically cleanse Gaza. The people who opposed Harris over Gaza should have expected this outcome, hence their naivete in somehow thinking Trump would be 'better'.

Dems didn't place any effective restraint on Israel. They just kept sending more and more weapons. So the choice was between not preventing genocide and cheering it on. If we're always going to be voting for centrists, what's your plan for there to ever be a leftist victory?

Travis B. wrote: ↑Wed Sep 03, 2025 4:54 pm I.e. doing what Zohran Mamdani did, but on a wider scale; fighting against the likes of Chuck Schumer in primary after primary. If the Republicans can primary center-right Republicans, we can primary centrist Democrats.

rotting bones wrote: ↑Tue Sep 02, 2025 10:35 pm

Travis B. wrote: ↑Tue Sep 02, 2025 10:36 am But but but we have to show people how right-wing the Dems are by attacking them at every opportunity (with the fact that the other major party is a bunch of real live fascists being merely an inconvenient sidenote).

Centrist Democrats constantly provoke leftists. They see Republicans as a force of nature they must always capitulate to. Leftists are the actual targets of their ire.

Travis B. wrote: ↑Tue Sep 02, 2025 10:36 am To be honest, I really want to ask the people here who said they weren't going to vote for Harris because she wasn't left-wing enough as to whether they are happy now. And yeah, those who didn't vote for Harris over Gaza should at least acknowledge their utter and complete naivete in the very least.

I tried to tell people, but it's human nature to prefer death over disability.

MacAnDàil wrote: ↑Thu Sep 04, 2025 9:06 am What is the basis for these affirmations?

rotting bones wrote: ↑Tue Sep 02, 2025 10:35 pm Centrist Democrats constantly provoke leftists. They see Republicans as a force of nature they must always capitulate to. Leftists are the actual targets of their ire.

rotting bones wrote: ↑Tue Sep 02, 2025 10:35 pm I tried to tell people, but it's human nature to prefer death over disability.

zompist wrote: ↑Mon Sep 01, 2025 11:36 pm

jcb wrote: ↑Mon Sep 01, 2025 3:58 pm President Trump, or maybe should I say "chairman Trump", has done some state capitalism by buying 10% of Intel to create a sovereign wealth fund, a thing that leftists like Bernie Sanders and Matt Bruenig have long advocated for. Trump has also said that he wants to make more "deals" like this.

Why are you cheerleading actual Nazi shit?

This is corrupt crony capitalism, getting the federal government deeply involved in some businesses and not others, for pure political reasons. As one analyst wrote, "When a president can dictate that leading American firms must pay the Treasury a couple of billion dollars in exchange for merger approval, market access, or other regulatory relief, tax policy becomes indistinguishable from extortion." Or another: "The president has assumed a quasi-authority to orchestrate how the private sector operates, both broadly and down to the management and ownership of individual companies."

Oh, and the administration "created a scorecard that rates 553 companies and trade associations on how hard they worked to support and promote President Trump's [bill]", according to Axios. Personal loyalty to the Führer is all that matters to the GOP now. As a reminder, national socialism did not actually create a thousand-year Reich.

While you're applauding this fascist takeover of business, Trump has ended collective bargaining rights for one milllion federal workers. You think Democrats don't promote unions enough; well, fascists destroy unions.

I'm dubious about claims that far leftists cost Harris the election. The group that should be (and so far as I know is) most abashed over their dereliction is Hispanics. (28% for Trump in 2016, 42% in 2024.)

rotting bones wrote: ↑Sun Sep 07, 2025 2:26 am

MacAnDàil wrote: ↑Thu Sep 04, 2025 9:06 am What is the basis for these affirmations?

rotting bones wrote: ↑Tue Sep 02, 2025 10:35 pm Centrist Democrats constantly provoke leftists. They see Republicans as a force of nature they must always capitulate to. Leftists are the actual targets of their ire.

From Bill Maher to Destiny to the entire attitude of Harris campaigners towards Democratic Socialists to these: https://www.reddit.com/r/moderatepolitics/s/DKtsFQDex8 https://youtu.be/_J5D2FRBza0?si=jePjFph4ixP-4Bkm ... Basically my entire lived experience.

rotting bones wrote: ↑Tue Sep 02, 2025 10:35 pm I tried to tell people, but it's human nature to prefer death over disability.

https://www.reuters.com/article/lifesty ... N7B320259/

malloc wrote: ↑Tue Sep 09, 2025 11:51 am Well the article says Americans would prefer death over disability, not necessarily humans in general, whereas Stephen Hawking was British.

MacAnDàil wrote: ↑Tue Sep 09, 2025 9:46 am Was Stephen Hawking against human nature?!

Raphael wrote: ↑Tue Sep 09, 2025 12:06 pm Well, "human nature" doesn't necessarily mean "good". Some people might manage it to be a bit better than what you might expect based on "human nature". It's arguably "human nature" to be xenophobic; despite that, some people manage it to be relatively less xenophobic.

Richard W wrote: ↑Wed Sep 10, 2025 6:55 am

MacAnDàil wrote: ↑Tue Sep 09, 2025 9:46 am Was Stephen Hawking against human nature?!

If suicide is ruled out, when did he have such a choice?

Ares Land wrote: ↑Wed Sep 10, 2025 7:45 am

Raphael wrote: ↑Tue Sep 09, 2025 12:06 pm Well, "human nature" doesn't necessarily mean "good". Some people might manage it to be a bit better than what you might expect based on "human nature". It's arguably "human nature" to be xenophobic; despite that, some people manage it to be relatively less xenophobic.

Is there even such a thing as 'human nature'? Well, there is - using language is part of it, for instance

I think, though, that appeals to human nature have no place in political debate. Since no one really knows what it is, it's all too easy to define it however you like.

malloc wrote: ↑Wed Sep 10, 2025 3:17 pm Stunning news just now. Right wing pundit Charlie Kirk has been shot and possibly killed. Regardless of how one feels about him or political violence in general, this represents quite the massive boost for the GOP and will undoubtedly strengthen popular support for them.