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Re: Brassica SCA [v1.0.0]
Posted: Tue May 05, 2026 7:27 am
by þeprussianfrog
Yay it's working again! Thanks!
Re: Brassica SCA [v1.0.0]
Posted: Thu May 07, 2026 5:00 pm
by Man in Space
I am having two issues: the wildcard
^ doesn’t seem to want to work and some categories aren’t being properly read. The affected rules are pitch accent and stop assimilation, respectively.
For the pitch accent rule, using
^Vacc _ and
_ ^Vacc doesn’t cause subsequent accents to disappear; using the specific environments
Vacc (C) (C) (V) (C) (C) (V) (C) (C) (V) (C) (C) (V) (C) (C) _ and
_ (C) (C) (V) (C) (C) (V) (C) (C) (V) (C) (C) Vacc does work—
e.g.,
ɢjabrə as the input comes out
ɢjábrə́ if I use
^Vacc.
For stop assimilation,
pʰəɢəwa first changes to
pʰɢəwa as expected, but the stop assimilation rule doesn't turn
pʰ to
b, rather it gives me
�.
Code: Select all
new categories
Nas = m n ɲ ŋ ɴ
Svcl = p t tʲ k q
Svcd = b d dʲ g ɢ
Svla = pʰ tʰ tʲʰ kʰ qʰ
Svca = bʰ dʰ dʲʰ gʰ ɢʰ
Fvcl = f s ʃ x χ h
Fvcd = v z ʒ ɣ ʁ
Apx = w r j 1 2
Vnac = a ə e i o u
Vacc = á ə́ é í ó ú
Fvcl = f s ʃ x χ h
Fvcd = v z ʒ ɣ ʁ
C = Nas Svcl Svcd Svla Svca Fvcl Fvcd Apx
S = Svcl Svcd Svla Svca
F = Fvcl Fvcd
R = Nas Apx
V = Vnac Vacc
X = Ø
end
;pitch accent
Vnac / Vacc / _ V
Vnac / Vacc / C C _ // Vacc (C) (C) (V) (C) (C) (V) (C) (C) (V) (C) (C) (V) (C) (C)_
Vnac / Vacc / # (C) (C) _ // _ (C) (C) (V) (C) (C) (V) (C) (C) (V) (C) (C) Vacc
;vowel deletions
[u ú i í] / / _ (C) (C) [w u ú j i í]
;initial-foot redundancy
[a á] / / # (C) (C) _ (C) (C) [a á]
[ə ə́] / / # (C) (C) _ (C) (C) [ə ə́]
[i í] / / # (C) (C) _ (C) (C) [i í]
[u ú] / / # (C) (C) _ (C) (C) [u ú]
[u ú i í] / / _ (C) (C) [w u ú j i í]
;final-foot redundancy
[a á] / / (C) (C) _ (C) (C) [a á] #
[ə ə́] / / (C) (C) _ (C) (C) [ə ə́] #
[i í] / / (C) (C) _ (C) (C) [i í] #
[u ú] / / (C) (C) _ (C) (C) [u ú] #
;final high vowel deletion
[i í u ú] / / [a á ə ə́] (C) (C) (V) (C) (C) (V) (C) (C) (V) (C) (C) (V) _ #
;final glide fortition?
[w j] / [v s] / V _ #
[w j] / [u i] / C _ #
;stop assimilation
[Svcd Svla Svca] / Svcl / _ Svcl
[Svcl Svla Svca] / Svcd / _ Svcd
[Svcl Svcd Svca] / Svla / _ Svla
[Svcl Svcd Svca] / Svca / _ Svca
The dummy word
pibi shows up as
bbi as is proper.
Re: Brassica SCA [v1.0.0]
Posted: Thu May 07, 2026 5:41 pm
by bradrn
Aaargh, not another wildcard problem… that syntax is almost more trouble than it’s worth, and the semantics confuses even me sometimes. Remind me to look into it tomorrow when I have time.
Re: Brassica SCA [v1.0.0]
Posted: Fri May 08, 2026 2:10 am
by Lērisama
Man in Space wrote: ↑Thu May 07, 2026 5:00 pm
For stop assimilation,
pʰəɢəwa first changes to
pʰɢəwa as expected, but the stop assimilation rule doesn't turn
pʰ to
b, rather it gives me
�.
To solve this problem, you need to change the stop assimilation rules to the following:
Code: Select all
;stop assimilation
[Svcd Svla Svca] / [Svcl Svcl Svcl] / _ Svcl
[Svcl Svla Svca] / [Svcd Svcd Svcd] / _ Svcd
[Svcl Svcd Svca] / [Svla Svla Svla] / _ Svla
[Svcl Svcd Svca] / [Svca Svca Svca] / _ Svca
This is because Brassica expands your original set of rules to
[b… pʰ… bʰ…] / [p…] / _ Svcl etc. and then replaces the categories one by one, and can't find anything to replace all but the first category on the left with, because the lengths are mismatched. There is a way to simplify this by using features to not have to reduntantly write everything out, but I'd need to take some to refamiliarise myself with them to work out exactly how.
Re: Brassica SCA [v1.0.0]
Posted: Fri May 08, 2026 5:31 am
by bradrn
Thank you Lērisama!
Lērisama wrote: ↑Fri May 08, 2026 2:10 am
This is because Brassica expands your original set of rules to
[b… pʰ… bʰ…] / [p…] / _ Svcl etc. and then replaces the categories one by one, and can't find anything to replace all but the first category on the left with, because the lengths are mismatched. There is a way to simplify this by using features to not have to reduntantly write everything out, but I'd need to take some to refamiliarise myself with them to work out exactly how.
I think something like
Stop / Stop$Phonation#assim / _ Stop$Phonation#assim. Though I haven’t tested it… honestly I need to refamiliarise myself with the syntax too.
Re: Brassica SCA [v1.0.0]
Posted: Fri May 08, 2026 6:13 am
by bradrn
Man in Space wrote: ↑Thu May 07, 2026 5:00 pm
For the pitch accent rule, using
^Vacc _ and
_ ^Vacc doesn’t cause subsequent accents to disappear
Could you give me the whole rule you tried which didn’t work?