Lemobrogian - the language of the Land of Eternal Spring.

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Ulmicola
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Lemobrogian - the language of the Land of Eternal Spring.

Post by Ulmicola »

So - I'm a NationStates player; and while I didn't have to worry about conlangs for the main country I RP as on that website, since it's closely modeled on the region surrounding the city where I live in (if the confederation of city-states it helmed during a brief period in the Middle Ages had survived, at least), there's a second country I RP as, and that's where things get weird. So, I thought, what if the acid trips of Frazer, Graves, and Gimbutas, about a matriarchal, peaceful Neolithic society, were true, after all? And what would it take for such a society, if it weren't a complete fabrication, to survive and thrive until the modern day? Also, this society is supposed to be culturally and linguistically related to that of another country in the game, RP'd by another player, because we needed to fill some plot holes.

Now, I have a very rough outline of the grammar of that country's language, but not much more than that; what do I do? Well, I made almost everything up, coming up with a naming language at first and, whenever I needed to expand on it for RP reasons, I tried to sketch out a plausible grammar for it, to make new names and phrases fit into an overall theme. Due to that other player's own preferences, there's quite a few Japanese-esque traits that made it in, and more than a few hints at what their native language is but, due to my intense, and probably pathological, dislike for asymmetry and certain combinations of letters and sounds - to such an extent, I tend to avoid writing those letters and sounds down at all, whenever possible - there's a lot of myself in the grammar and phonology, too.

Since that browser game has a Wikipedia-esque website of its own, I wrote an article fit for it, rather than for any kind of conlanging forum, so it's going to be a very rough summary of the language (also because, well, I kind of made it up as I went along, according to need), but there's a little bit of everything. Here's a very abridged extract from it:
The Lemobrogic languages form a dialect continuum, in which neighboring varieties are mutually intelligible, but widely separated varieties are not; Lemobrogian is a conservative and literary register of these languages, and it serves as the lingua franca of Lemobrogia. Even though most people in the country do not speak it as their first language, it is easily comprehensible and largely intelligible not only for average and ordinary speakers of the Lemobrogic languages, but also for cultured and educated speakers of [RELATED LANGUAGE].

The phonology and phonotactics of Lemobrogian are fairly plain and regular, sharing several key characteristics with [RELATED LANGUAGE]: the language consists of 27 consonant phonemes and 9 vowel phonemes; they are usually paired in CV syllables, but the language's phonotactics also allow for word-initial vowels and word-final consonants, as well as for sonorant consonants as syllable codas, that allow for word-medial consonant clusters consisting of a sonorant and another consonant.

Image

In addition to the above, there are also 6 diphthongs: [ei̯], [ou̯] and [aɛ̯] are closing (and quite frequent); [ɛ̯a], [i̯e] and [u̯o] are opening (and less frequent). Northern or lowland vernaculars are notable for either the presence of additional [ä̯ə] and [əä̯] diphthongs, especially northeastern vernaculars such as the Ŋéžó language, or for the presence of vowel length in stead of diphthongs, especially northwestern vernaculars.

Lemobrogian's basic word order is object-subject-verb; it is a chiefly isolating language: beyond adhering to a very basic grammatical gender system, nouns are not subject to declension, and verbs are not subject to conjugation - instead, particles follow nouns and verbs to convey additional information about them. A not insignificant number of proper nouns, ending in a consonant preceded by [a], are the result of noun/particle fusion: in fact, this characteristic ending is so widespread, that it has turned into a de facto third gender, with adjectives (in Lemobrogian, they follow the nouns they depend on, and take on their grammatical gender suffix) agreeing with this ending as with any other grammatical gender suffix. Verbs, on the other hand, end in [ə]; the basic form of the verb, when not followed by a particle, acts as an infinitive or as a present tense, depending on context.

In addition to the very basic grammatical gender system detailed above, that provides a fusional feature to the Lemobrogian language's chiefly isolating nature, the tongue's penchant for compounding provides an agglutinative feature to it; unlike adjectives, that follow the nouns they depend on, the compounded or composited parts of speech that are added to a root word in order to create a new lexeme precede the nouns they depend on, whatever their nature. The native endonym for Lemobrogia - Daènókèŋó - is, itself, a compound in which the Lemobrogian term for "country", kèŋó, is preceded by the Lemobrogian term for "elm tree", daèné, whose inflectional suffix has been made to agree in grammatical gender and vowel height with the former term by the rules detailed above.

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The variant of the Latin alphabet used to write present-day Lemobrogian, based on the [RELATED LANGUAGE] one, was adopted only as late as 1992 CE, with the end of [OTHER COUNTRY]'s protectorate over Lemobrogia. This alphabet is highly phonetic, and each letter represents exactly one sound; while there are, in fact, instances in which the present-day Lemobrogian alphabet does not fully align with how it is spoken, these instances follow very specific and predictable rules.

Image
And that is all, for now; as for the country itself, it's situated on a subtropical highland plateau that experiences weather of around 20 degrees Celsius all year round and is incredibly fertile, making Lemobrogia live up to its sobriquet... except, it's also in a region that makes the Ring of Fire seem calm, so the locals never had to wage war with each other for resources that were widely available, but had to team up with each other to brave the elements, because earthquakes and eruptions could happen at any time. Since the Gimbutas-esque status quo hinted at above could only live on due to the land being quite isolated, Lemobrogia spent a whole lot of time in a Bronze Age stasis of sorts until it was inevitably discovered by horse-riding, iron-wielding foreign powers; the locals avoided the inevitable only by pursuing a vaguely Japan/Thailand-style diplomacy several centuries ahead of schedule, playing said foreign powers against each other while adopting useful technology from them, but even that couldn't prevent annexation - at least, both the elites and the subjects of the local fiefdoms retained considerable autonomy, in part due to how remote Lemobrogia was.

Eventually, those empires waned, but the experience made a subset of the population renounce Lemobrogia's traditional matriarchal, pacifistic ways; the plateau's monarchies unified in order to counter this threat - the defeated radicals eventually migrated to that culturally related country, installing an absolute monarchy there that, by the 20th century, had gained actual fascist traits - but the highlands were so weakened that the ruling royalty had to import migrants from abroad to recoup the losses, and become a protectorate of a rising colonial power, again getting a relatively favourable deal out of it for more or less the same reasons - if Bhutan and Nepal could do it... anyway, come the 20th century, Lemobrogia, now a semi-constitutional monarchy ruled by a hereditary queen and an elected king (echoes of those two nutjobs there, of course), experimented with Georgism and then, come the first signs of environmental degradation in the mid-20th century, it elected to the throne a monarcho-socialist vaguely based on Carlos Hugo of Bourbon, that collaborated with the government in order to enact policies Le Guin would've been proud of but, even then, s**t happened.

In 2024, Lemobrogia's not a bad country to live in - sure, a frightening percentage of the nation's GDP goes towards trying to undo the damage early- to mid-20th century mass industrialization did to it, and to mitigate the consequences of global warming, but local politics are remarkably clean and participatory, and while no one's filthy rich, no one is dirt poor, either; okay, the above mentioned environmental damage has led to the birth of some cults that are basically Aum Shinrikyo meets Poison Ivy, the descendants of those warlike renegades that set up a fascist regime abroad have been welcomed back into the country after that regime fell, and hardcore pacifism can get very weird when you look down on butchers as impure, oppose the digging of railroad tunnels due to it being a rape of the earth, and some of your religious rituals would make bonobos seem like prudes, especially when you hypocritically delegate the country's defense to the 21st century equivalent of Italian condottieri from the Renaissance, (that is, PMCs based in my other RP country with a very flexible understanding of human rights and rules of engagement), but at least the weather's nice, you can live a decent life no matter who you are, new anti-seismic technologies have been quite the welcome development, and the metal scene is thriving.
Zju
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Re: Lemobrogian - the language of the Land of Eternal Spring.

Post by Zju »

I like the idea of the four cell table containing with declaration of the human rights, though the gloss could be more easily readable if it was directly below the Lemobrogian text and aligned to it.
/j/ <j>

Ɂaləɂahina asəkipaɂə ileku omkiroro salka.
Loɂ ɂerleku asəɂulŋusikraɂə seləɂahina əɂətlahɂun əiŋɂiɂŋa.
Hərlaɂ. Hərlaɂ. Hərlaɂ. Hərlaɂ. Hərlaɂ. Hərlaɂ. Hərlaɂ.
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Ulmicola
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Re: Lemobrogian - the language of the Land of Eternal Spring.

Post by Ulmicola »

Zju wrote: Sat Jan 06, 2024 2:47 pm I like the idea of the four cell table containing with declaration of the human rights, though the gloss could be more easily readable if it was directly below the Lemobrogian text and aligned to it.
Noted; making it all align was kinda hard, this is what worked:

Image

As you can see, I did a slight rework of the case and verbal particles, because I was going overboard with the very specific cases for every circumstance; Lemobrogian isn't supposed to be a Caucasian or Uralic language, after all. :P I used the six most common cases in world languages according to the case hierarchy Wikipedia article to save time, realized the result was kind of too Latin, replaced the ablative with the instrumental - so that the locative can take over the "to/from" functions of the ablative, and the instrumental can double as a comitative, ornative, etc.

Image

The fact that they're both 6x2 tables with 12 possible case and mood combinations each (if you count infinitives and nominatives) is not a coincidence, 12 and its divisors and multiples are kind of a running theme with Lemobrogia's worldbuilding: both because I wanted to impose a limit on myself to avoid going overboard (as happened earlier), and because, in-universe, that's a sacred number for the Lemobrogian people, as it was for several IRL peoples; hell, even the language is composed of 36 phonemes, mostly those of the above-mentioned related language, and a few more to get to a round 36. :P
bradrn
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Re: Lemobrogian - the language of the Land of Eternal Spring.

Post by bradrn »

Let me point out that the ZBB supports tables natively:

Youcanmakethem
using theBBCodeshownbelow:

Code: Select all

[table]
[rowh][cell]You[/cell][cell]can[/cell][cell]make[/cell][cell]them[/cell][/rowh]
[row][cellh]using the[/cellh][cell]BBCode[/cell][cell]shown[/cell][cell]below:[/cell][/row]
[/table]

It also supports properly formatted glosses:

Xòreí
free
vòhuži
human
nòbési
all
þaènə,
be
etc

Code: Select all

[gloss=free]Xòreí[/gloss] [gloss=human]vòhuži[/gloss] [gloss=all]nòbési[/gloss] [gloss=be]þaènə,[/gloss] [gloss=etc]…[/gloss]
…which leads me to realise that your provided gloss is really confusing, since the words of the gloss don’t actually seem to line up with the Lembrogian.
Conlangs: Scratchpad | Texts | antilanguage
Software: See http://bradrn.com/projects.html
Other: Ergativity for Novices

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Ulmicola
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Re: Lemobrogian - the language of the Land of Eternal Spring.

Post by Ulmicola »

bradrn wrote: Mon Jan 08, 2024 6:49 am Let me point out that the ZBB supports tables natively:

Youcanmakethem
using theBBCodeshownbelow:

Code: Select all

[table]
[rowh][cell]You[/cell][cell]can[/cell][cell]make[/cell][cell]them[/cell][/rowh]
[row][cellh]using the[/cellh][cell]BBCode[/cell][cell]shown[/cell][cell]below:[/cell][/row]
[/table]

It also supports properly formatted glosses:

Xòreí
free
vòhuži
human
nòbési
all
þaènə,
be
etc

Code: Select all

[gloss=free]Xòreí[/gloss] [gloss=human]vòhuži[/gloss] [gloss=all]nòbési[/gloss] [gloss=be]þaènə,[/gloss] [gloss=etc]…[/gloss]
…which leads me to realise that your provided gloss is really confusing, since the words of the gloss don’t actually seem to line up with the Lembrogian.
I know, that's because I'm working with quite the clunky Wikipedia clone.

Here's the finished (more or less, it's still a very basic overview of the language) page: https://iiwiki.us/wiki/Lemobrogian_language
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salem
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Re: Lemobrogian - the language of the Land of Eternal Spring.

Post by salem »

Ulmicola wrote: Mon Jan 08, 2024 11:31 am I know, that's because I'm working with quite the clunky Wikipedia clone.

Here's the finished (more or less, it's still a very basic overview of the language) page: https://iiwiki.us/wiki/Lemobrogian_language
By "the words of the gloss don't actually seem to line up with the Lemobrogian", I think that what was meant is that you've glossed the four-term xòreí vòhuži nòbési þaènə with six terms (free human beings all be born-NFUT.INF), meaning there is technically no clear one-to-one correspondence. Best practice for morphemes that gloss to a multiword phrase in English is to join the words with either underscores (free human_beings all be_born-NFUT.INF) or periods (free human.beings all be.born-NFUT.INF).

Generally in glosses it's also nice to separate out the morphemes in the text being glossed with the same notation as in the gloss itself (in this case separating out the nonfuture infinitive ending with a hyphen):

xòreí
free
vòhuži
human_beings
nòbési
all
þaèn-ə
be_born-NFUT.INF


But that's not strictly necessary. And all that said, I like what you've got here! It has a rhythmic feel to it that goes well with its being spread as a sort of bardic lingua franca.
Last edited by salem on Tue Jan 09, 2024 2:41 am, edited 1 time in total.
bradrn
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Re: Lemobrogian - the language of the Land of Eternal Spring.

Post by bradrn »

salem wrote: Tue Jan 09, 2024 2:03 am
Ulmicola wrote: Mon Jan 08, 2024 11:31 am I know, that's because I'm working with quite the clunky Wikipedia clone.

Here's the finished (more or less, it's still a very basic overview of the language) page: https://iiwiki.us/wiki/Lemobrogian_language
By "the words of the gloss don't actually seem to line up with the Lemgrogian", I think that what was meant is that you've glossed the four-term xòreí vòhuži nòbési þaènə with six terms (free human beings all be born-NFUT.INF), meaning there is technically no clear one-to-one correspondence. Best practice for morphemes that gloss to a multiword phrase in English is to join the words with either underscores (free human_beings all be_born-NFUT.INF) or periods (free human.beings all be.born-NFUT.INF).
Yes, precisely. (I tend to prefer a period for this, as do the Leipzig Glossing Rules.)
Conlangs: Scratchpad | Texts | antilanguage
Software: See http://bradrn.com/projects.html
Other: Ergativity for Novices

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Ulmicola
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Re: Lemobrogian - the language of the Land of Eternal Spring.

Post by Ulmicola »

salem wrote: Tue Jan 09, 2024 2:03 am
Ulmicola wrote: Mon Jan 08, 2024 11:31 am I know, that's because I'm working with quite the clunky Wikipedia clone.

Here's the finished (more or less, it's still a very basic overview of the language) page: https://iiwiki.us/wiki/Lemobrogian_language
By "the words of the gloss don't actually seem to line up with the Lemobrogian", I think that what was meant is that you've glossed the four-term xòreí vòhuži nòbési þaènə with six terms (free human beings all be born-NFUT.INF), meaning there is technically no clear one-to-one correspondence. Best practice for morphemes that gloss to a multiword phrase in English is to join the words with either underscores (free human_beings all be_born-NFUT.INF) or periods (free human.beings all be.born-NFUT.INF).

Generally in glosses it's also nice to separate out the morphemes in the text being glossed with the same notation as in the gloss itself (in this case separating out the nonfuture infinitive ending with a hyphen):


xòreí
free
vòhuži
human_beings
nòbési
all
þaèn-ə
be_born-NFUT.INF


But that's not strictly necessary. And all that said, I like what you've got here! It has a rhythmic feel to it that goes well with its being spread as a sort of bardic lingua franca.
I will do that... as soon as I get back home from work. :P

And yes, the rhythmic feel is very much intentional - or, at least, when the language was still in its early, just a naming language stage, I tended to have nearby words be allitterative or rhyming, or at least have the same number of syllables, for more or less the same reason why Stan Lee had a fixation for allitterative names, that is, it's all easier to remember; then, when I noticed that pattern, I decided to run with it: in the country's main Wikipedia-esque exposition, I already stated that, in a country so forested and hilly, traveling singers often doubled as the main source of information about the outside world, for those living in small villages, and they were revered to such an extent that not even the Industrial Revolution could put an end to their trade, since they often got hired for educating and entertaining workers in the middle of their shifts - after all, listening to music or podcasts while working takes a lot out of the drudgery of it even today.

With the advent of modern media, they probably influenced local actors and singers, and also radio and television, but being able to improvise a story or tell a classic tale might still be a respected art form, just like poetry in the modern Arab world, with contemporary "bards" doing improvisational theatre and rakugo with equal ease.

Edit: done, even though that wiki doesn't support proper interlinear glosses, so I had to get creative.

Image

I've also begun the process of distancing the English gloss from the "official" translation.
Ahzoh
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Re: Lemobrogian - the language of the Land of Eternal Spring.

Post by Ahzoh »

Ah, a fellow non-future versus future enjoyer. Not too many of us.
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Ulmicola
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Re: Lemobrogian - the language of the Land of Eternal Spring.

Post by Ulmicola »

Ahzoh wrote: Wed Jan 10, 2024 4:17 am Ah, a fellow non-future versus future enjoyer. Not too many of us.
That's a holdover from a very early version of the language - I'd asked for advice about it and, while most of that advice didn't make the cut for one reason or another, the non-future/future tenses did; just as I had a case system similar to but not quite the same as that of Latin, a language I learned in high school, for ease of use, I used the non-future/future tenses because it's basically English, but the other way around.

The same can be said about moods, it's a configuration that's halfway between that of English and Italian, stripped down to the bare minimum; the animate/inanimate genders on the other hand, I had to find a way to preserve the gender distinction that the related Gylic languages dropped, without making it too similar to the one found in my native tongue.

Thankfully, the few scraps of Gylic on that wiki do include a couple personal pronouns, so I was able to adapt one of them in the above text; my idea was to have 1st, 2nd and 3rd person pronouns, with no inherent number, but with clusivity in the first person (so that the first person inclusive can double as a de facto plural when needed), a T-V distinction in the second person (another feature that the Gylic languages made away with), and a gender distinction in the third person. Reciprocal and reflexive forms would be determined by a prefix, something I already included in the excerpt above, as would possessive forms - perhaps, with an alienable possession/inalienable possession distinction, so that the "They are endowed with reason and conscience" line could read something like reason-INAN conscience-INAN 3.AN.INAL, "reason [and] conscience [are] inalienably theirs", for example.

Thoughts?
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Ulmicola
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Re: Lemobrogian - the language of the Land of Eternal Spring.

Post by Ulmicola »

In the end, I kept it simple, with the personal pronouns:

Image
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