Modern Gothic

Conworlds and conlangs
evmdbm
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Re: Modern Gothic

Post by evmdbm »

Emily wrote: Fri Aug 11, 2023 12:45 am lastly, below is the indefinite article ains; the competing indefinite article saums declines exactly the same except with the stem /sɔm-/ instead of /ɛn-/
When do you use ains as opposed to saums or vice versa?

dual and plural forms of the indefinite article? Curious how that works. How would you translate it into English "two"; "some"? There is no plural of the indefinite article in German (say) after all
hwhatting
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Re: Modern Gothic

Post by hwhatting »

evmdbm wrote: Tue Aug 15, 2023 6:15 am dual and plural forms of the indefinite article? Curious how that works. How would you translate it into English "two"; "some"? There is no plural of the indefinite article in German (say) after all
Romance languages like Spanish have plural forms of the indefinite article (unos, unas); they normally get translated as "some".
Moose-tache
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Re: Modern Gothic

Post by Moose-tache »

alice wrote: Tue Aug 15, 2023 2:54 am
Moose-tache wrote: Tue Aug 15, 2023 2:01 am Using sin for is replaces one ambiguity with another. Do Middle Gothic speakers ever get confused by sentences like “Jack showed John what was left of his book?”
Since this is precisely what happened in Dutch and German, I don't think so.
So if I understand you correctly, there is one and only one possible interpretation of the sentence "Hij ontving zijn boek." Is that right? How are the different combinations of referrant handled?
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Emily
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Re: Modern Gothic

Post by Emily »

adjectives (phase one—middle gothic)
like nouns, middle gothic has strong and weak adjectives. unlike nouns, however, where a noun will fall into one class or another (or neither), strong and weak adjectives are two different declension patterns that (for the most part) are used with the same adjectives—that is, with a few exceptions, any adjective can have either strong or weak declension depending on its use within a sentence. in a nutshell, weak declension is used to indicate definiteness (and is required after definite articles, after demonstratives, etc), and strong declension is used to indicate indefiniteness (and is used after indefinite articles). the multiple different stems of old gothic adjectives have merged into two declensions by middle gothic: declensions 1 and 2. broadly speaking, declension 2 descends from certain u-stem adjectives in old gothic and from adjectives whose final consonants ended with /w/ or a labiovelar. certain old gothic declensions went one direction if they were mostly used to describe a person (which would make them most commonly used in nominative/vocative/accusative cases and in the singular), and a different direction otherwise

as described in the post on nouns, the palatalization found in the genitive case in much of the strong declensions (and in nouns and other parts of speech) became an indicator of genitiveness (genitivity?) and was generalized throughout the declensions
More: show
declension 1: strong
CaseMasc SgNeut SgFem SgMasc PlNeut PlFem Pl
Noms/zaɛaos
Accanaanzaos
Datamamɛɛmɛmɛm
Genʲɛsʲɛsʲɛzʲɛʒʲɛʒʲɛz
after a palatal consonant, the masc nom sg is /ɛs/ and the neut nom/acc sg is /ɛ/. after non-palatals, the masc nom sg is /z/ if it immediately follows a voiced consonant and /s/ otherwise

declension 2: strong
CaseMasc SgNeut SgFem SgMasc PlNeut PlFem Pl
Noms/zɔsɔɔos
Accɔnɔsɔnzɔos
Datɔmɔmɔɔmɔmɔm
Genʲɔsʲɔsʲɔzʲɔʒʲɔʒʲɔz
after a palatal consonant, the masc nom sg is /ɔs/ and the neut nom/acc sg is /ɔ/. after non-palatals, the masc nom sg is /z/ if it immediately follows a voiced consonant and /s/ otherwise. (declension 2 adjectives with palatal final consonants are very rare, however)

declension 1: weak
CaseMasc SgNeut SgFem SgMasc PlNeut PlFem Pl
Nomaooanzononz
Accanoonanzononz
Datɛnɛnonamamom
Genʲɛnzʲɛnzʲonzʲaɲʲaɲʲon
declension 2: weak
CaseMasc SgNeut SgFem SgMasc PlNeut PlFem Pl
Nomɔooɔnzononz
Accɔnoonɔnzononz
Datɔnɔnonɔmɔmom
Genʲɔnzʲɔnzʲonzʲɔɲʲɔɲʲon
examples:
More: show
declension 1: /hɛ́ʊts/ haits "hot"
strong
CaseMasc SgNeut SgFem SgMasc PlNeut PlFem Pl
Nomhɛ́ʊtshɛ́ʊthɛ́ʊtahɛ́ʊtɛhɛ́ʊtahɛ́ʊtos
Acchɛ́ʊtanhɛ́ʊthɛ́ʊtahɛ́ʊtanzhɛ́ʊtahɛ́ʊtos
Dathɛ́ʊtamhɛ́ʊtamhɛ́ʊtɛhɛ́ʊtɛmhɛ́ʊtɛmhɛ́ʊtɛm
Genhɛ́ʊʧɛshɛ́ʊʧɛshɛ́ʊʧɛzhɛ́ʊʧɛʒhɛ́ʊʧɛʒhɛ́ʊʧɛz
weak
CaseMasc SgNeut SgFem SgMasc PlNeut PlFem Pl
Nomhɛ́ʊtahɛ́ʊtohɛ́ʊtohɛ́ʊtanzhɛ́ʊtonhɛ́ʊtonz
Acchɛ́ʊtanhɛ́ʊtohɛ́ʊtonhɛ́ʊtanzhɛ́ʊtonhɛ́ʊtonz
Dathɛ́ʊtɛnhɛ́ʊtɛnhɛ́ʊtonhɛ́ʊtamhɛ́ʊtamhɛ́ʊtom
Genhɛ́ʊʧɛnzhɛ́ʊʧɛnzhɛ́ʊʧonzhɛ́ʊʧaɲhɛ́ʊʧaɲhɛ́ʊʧon
declension 1: /vrɛ́ʊɲɛs/ wrainis "clean, pure"
strong
CaseMasc SgNeut SgFem SgMasc PlNeut PlFem Pl
Nomvrɛ́ʊɲɛsvrɛ́ʊɲɛvrɛ́ʊɲavrɛ́ʊɲɛvrɛ́ʊɲavrɛ́ʊɲos
Accvrɛ́ʊɲanvrɛ́ʊɲɛvrɛ́ʊɲavrɛ́ʊɲanzvrɛ́ʊɲavrɛ́ʊɲos
Datvrɛ́ʊɲamvrɛ́ʊɲamvrɛ́ʊɲɛvrɛ́ʊɲɛmvrɛ́ʊɲɛmvrɛ́ʊɲɛm
Genvrɛ́ʊɲɛsvrɛ́ʊɲɛsvrɛ́ʊɲɛzvrɛ́ʊɲɛʒvrɛ́ʊɲɛʒvrɛ́ʊɲɛz
weak
CaseMasc SgNeut SgFem SgMasc PlNeut PlFem Pl
Nomvrɛ́ʊɲavrɛ́ʊɲovrɛ́ʊɲovrɛ́ʊɲanzvrɛ́ʊɲonvrɛ́ʊɲonz
Accvrɛ́ʊɲanvrɛ́ʊɲovrɛ́ʊɲonvrɛ́ʊɲanzvrɛ́ʊɲonvrɛ́ʊɲonz
Datvrɛ́ʊɲɛnvrɛ́ʊɲɛnvrɛ́ʊɲonvrɛ́ʊɲamvrɛ́ʊɲamvrɛ́ʊɲom
Genvrɛ́ʊɲɛnzvrɛ́ʊɲɛnzvrɛ́ʊɲonzvrɛ́ʊɲaɲvrɛ́ʊɲaɲvrɛ́ʊɲon
declension 2: /túlgz/ tulgs "stubborn"
strong
CaseMasc SgNeut SgFem SgMasc PlNeut PlFem Pl
Nomtúlgztúlgtúlgɔstúlgɔtúlgɔtúlgos
Acctúlgɔntúlgtúlgɔstúlgɔnztúlgɔtúlgos
Dattúlgɔmtúlgɔmtúlgɔtúlgɔmtúlgɔmtúlgɔm
Gentúlʣɔstúlʣɔstúlʣɔztúlʣɔʒtúlʣɔʒtúlʣɔz
weak
CaseMasc SgNeut SgFem SgMasc PlNeut PlFem Pl
Nomtúlgɔtúlgotúlgotúlgɔnztúlgontúlgonz
Acctúlgɔntúlgotúlgontúlgɔnztúlgontúlgonz
Dattúlgɔntúlgɔntúlgontúlgɔmtúlgɔmtúlgom
Gentúlʣɔnztúlʣɔnztúlʣonztúlʣɔɲtúlʣɔɲtúlʣon

comparatives and superlatives
old gothic adjectives formed their comparatives and superlatives with a suffix following the stem and followed in turn by an inflectional ending. the comparative suffix was either -ōz- or -iz, and the superlative ending was either -ōst- or -ist. linguists have to my knowledge not found any consistent pattern that predicts whether the vowel will be ō or i, whether environmental or otherwise. by middle gothic, the situation has simplified somewhat: stems with non-palatal final consonants have the comparative -oz- and superlative -ost-, and stems with palatal final consonants have -ɛz- and -ɛst-. in old gothic, comparatives had an irregular declension for the feminine gender; in middle gothic this has regularized to the normal adjective declensions. likewise, while old gothic restricted comparatives to weak declensions, by middle gothic both comparatives and superlatives can be declined as either strong or weak, as appropriate for the context. (the strong masc nom sg ending for comparatives is /-ɛs/.) comparatives and superlatives always use declension 1 endings, even with declension 2 roots. thus, the comparative and superlative forms for the adjectives used in our above examples:
  • haits: comparative hɛ́ʊtozɛs, hɛ́ʊtoz, hɛ́ʊtoza...; hɛ́ʊtoza, hɛ́ʊtozo, hɛ́ʊtozo...; superlative hɛ́ʊtosts, hɛ́ʊtost, hɛ́ʊtosta...; hɛ́ʊtosta, hɛ́ʊtosto, hɛ́ʊtosto...
  • wrainis: comparative vrɛ́ʊɲɛzɛs, vrɛ́ʊɲɛz, vrɛ́ʊɲɛza...; vrɛ́ʊɲɛza, vrɛ́ʊɲɛzo, vrɛ́ʊɲɛzo...; superlative vrɛ́ʊɲɛsts, vrɛ́ʊɲɛst, vrɛ́ʊɲɛsta...; vrɛ́ʊɲɛsta, vrɛ́ʊɲɛsto, vrɛ́ʊɲɛsto...
  • tulgs: comparative túlgozɛs, túlgoz, túlgoza...; túlgoza, túlgozo, túlgozo...; superlative túlgosts, túlgost, túlgosta...; túlgosta, túlgosto, túlgosto...
it should be noted that any inflectional ending terminating in a vowel deleted said vowel in comparatives and superlatives. this is the result of a regular sound change, and in fact takes place with multisyllabic roots throughout middle gothic's inflectional system. however, this "silent" ending is almost invariably written as though it were pronounced, and was reinserted by analogy to monosyllables early in the transition from middle gothic to early modern gothic, so i'm indicating it rather than deleting it for simplicity

nascent dual
the dual number has not formally appeared in non-demonstrative adjectives by the time of middle gothic. however, probably due to the increasing prominence of dual forms in pronouns and in articles and other demonstratives, it is very common to explicitly state "two" before such a noun. middle gothic adjectives can appear before or after nouns; when they appear before, the numeral immediately follows them, which leads to the later development of dual inflections (discussed when we get to early modern gothic)
Last edited by Emily on Sun Aug 20, 2023 4:00 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Emily
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Re: Modern Gothic

Post by Emily »

numerals (phase one—middle gothic)
i was gonna put this in the adjective post but it was getting too long

in middle gothic, the numbers 1 through 19 are adjectives, but their declensions are eccentric

1
the number 1, /ɛ́ʊnz/, is a regular class 1 adjective and always uses the strong declension, even after an article. alone among the numerals, it can appear in both the singular and the plural, with the plural in this case meaning "only" or "alone". unlike the indefinite article, the stem of "one" is always stressed

2 and 3
the numbers 2 and 3 decline irregularly. unusually, the masculine and feminine merge in the inflection of 3 (but not 2)
More: show
two
CaseMascNeutFem
Nomdvɔ́ʊdvɔ́dvwás
Accdvɔ́nzdvɔ́dvwás
Datdvɔ́ʊmdvɔ́ʊmdvɔ́ʊm
Gendvɔ́ʊʤedvɔ́ʊʤedvɔ́ʊʤo
three
CaseMasc/FemNeut
Nomʒjásʃíja
Accʃínzʃíja
Datʃímʃím
Genʃíjeʃíje
4 to 6
the numbers 4, 5, and 6 (/fíðvor/ fidwor, /fímv/ fimf, /sɛ́xs/ saihs) decline for case, but not for gender. they each follow the same pattern: nominative /-∅/, accusative /-ʲɛnz/, dative /-ʲɛm/, genitive /-ʲe/:
  • 4: fíðvor, fíðvojɛnz, fíðvojɛm, fíðvoje
  • 5: fímv, fímvɛnz, fímvɛm, fímve
  • 6: sɛ́xs, sɛ́çʃɛnz, sɛ́çʃɛm, sɛ́çʃe
7 to 12
the numbers 7 through 12 decline similarly to 4 through 6, except that their accusative forms match their nominative forms, and there are some slight irregularities in a couple of stems:
  • 7: ʃívɔn, ʃívɔɲɛm, ʃívɔɲe
  • 8: áxtɔ, áçʧɛm, áçʧe
  • 9: ɲján, ɲjáɲɛm, ɲjáɲe
  • 10: tɛ́hɔn, tɛ́hɔɲɛm, tɛ́hɔɲe
  • 11: ɛ́ʊɲɛf, ɛ́ʊɲɛvɛm, ɛ́ʊɲɛve
  • 12: dvɔ́jɛf, dvɔ́jɛvɛm, dvɔ́jɛve
13 to 19
the numbers 13 through 19 are generally indeclinable adjectives, though they occasionally have inflections similar to those of 7 through 12
  • 13: ʒjástɛhɔn
  • 14: fíðvordɛhɔn
  • 15: fímvdɛhɔn
  • 16: sɛ́xstɛhɔn
  • 17: ʃívɔndɛhɔn
  • 18: áxtɛhɔn
  • 19: ɲjándɛhɔn
20 to 69
beginning with 20, the numerals become nouns instead of adjectives. the numeral takes the case appropriate for its position in the sentence, and the referent noun follows it in the genitive. for example, in the sentence "20 men entered the room", the number "20" is nominative, while in "I saw 20 men" it is accusative; in both sentences "men" is genitive. descriptive adjectives may precede or follow, and agree with, either the numeral or the referent noun, but all articles and determiners precede and agree with the numeral

strictly speaking, the round numbers 20, 30, 40, etc. are noun phrases consisting of the declined numeral 2 through 6 (using masculine forms) followed by a plural strong-declension noun /ʧɛʝɔs/ tigjaus. this is how they are written in texts of the period (e.g. dwau tigjaus rather than *dwautigjaus), and the changes the multipliers go through in the different cases (e.g. dvɔ́ʊʧɛʝɔs, dvɔ́ɲʒʤɛɣɔnz, dvɔ́ʊmʤɛɣɔm, dvɔ́ʊʤeʧɛʝɛv) are further evidence of this. however, the numbers are pronounced as though they were one word, with palatalizations and voicing assimilation that normally doesn't take place across word boundaries. the numbers are (in order nom, acc, dat, gen):
  • 20: dvɔ́ʊʧɛʝɔs, dvɔ́ɲʒʤɛɣɔnz, dvɔ́ʊmʤɛɣɔm, dvɔ́ʊʤeʧɛʝɛv
  • 30: ʒjáʃʧɛʝɔs, ʃíɲʒʤɛɣɔnz, ʃímʤɛɣɔm, ʃíjeʧɛʝɛv
  • 40: fíðvojʤɛʝɔs, fíðvojɛɲʒʤɛɣɔnz, fíðvojɛmʤɛɣɔm, fíðvojeʧɛʝɛv
  • 50: fímvʤɛʝɔs, fímvɛɲʒʤɛɣɔnz, fímvɛmʤɛɣɔm, fímveʧɛʝɛv
  • 60: sɛ́çʃʧɛʝɔs, sɛ́çʃɛɲʒʤɛɣɔnz, sɛ́çʃɛmʤɛɣɔm, sɛ́çʃeʧɛʝɛv
the intermediate numbers (21, 22, 23...) are formally composed of the above round numbers, followed by jah "and" (here appearing as an affix /Jax/), followed by the inflected numeral: /ʒjáʃʧɛʝɔʃaxfíðvor/ "34 (nom.)", /ʃíɲʒʤɛɣɔɲʒaxfíðvojɛnz/ "34 (acc.)", etc. the final /x/ of jah can itself assimilate to the palatalization and/or voicing of the following numeral. however, jah is often deleted, presumably due to the potential confusion with the forms of "8", and the words simply run together: /ʒjáʃʧɛʝɔzdvɔ́ʊ/ "32". when the "remainder" number (the "1" in "31", the "3" in "63") is 1, 2, or 3, there is great confusion in texts of the period as to whether it should match the gender of the round number (which is always masculine) or that of the noun being modified; furthermore, when the number is specifically "1" (e.g. 31, 51), there is a similar confusion about whether it should be singular or plural

70 to 100
the round numbers from 70 to 100 are indeclinable nouns:
  • 70: ʃívɔɲʤehɔnd
  • 80: áxtɔɲʤehɔnd
  • 90: ɲjáɲʤehɔnd
  • 100: tɛ́hɔɲʤehɔnd
intermediate numbers (71–79, etc.) are formed the same was as those from 21–69, with the same confusions described above. when the jah is eliminated, the "remainder" numbers often appear in their nominative form regardless of the position of the number in the sentence

200 to 900
similar to the numbers 20 through 60, the round numbers from 200 to 900 consist of a declined multiplier (using neuter forms) followed by a declined noun, pronounced as one word. the stem for "hundred" is /hɔnd-/, and it declines as a plural noun in the strong 6th declension. so /sɛ́xshɔnda/ "600 (nom)", /fíðvojɛnzhɔnda/ "400 (acc)", /ɲjáɲehɔɲʤe/ "900 (gen), etc. the intermediate numbers are produced as above

1000+
the word for 1000 is /ðwásɔɲʤ(i)/, which declines as a regular feminine noun in the strong 4th declension

the terms for 2000, 3000, etc. are once again based on a multiplier and a declined noun, in this case /þusɔɲʤos/, a feminine noun in the strong 4th declension (which becomes /ðusɔɲʤ-/ following a voiced consonant. intermediates are formed as above: /ðwásɔɲʤaxsɛ́çʃʧɛʝɔʃaxsɛ́xs/ þosonddji jah saihs tigjaus jah saihs "1,066 (nom)", /fíðvojɛmðusɔɲʤomjaʝɲjáɲɛmhɔndamjaxáxtɔɲʤehɔɲʤaçʃívɔɲɛm/ fidworim þusonddjom jah niunim haundam jah ahtaunddjehaund jah siwaunim "4,987 (dat)"

combining larger multiplers (from 20,000 up) involves placing the thousands into the genitive just as any other noun would be: /fíðvojɛɲʒʤɛɣɔɲʒaxfímvɛnzðusɔɲʤɛvjaɣdvɔ́ʊʤehɔɲʤejaxɛ́ʊɲɛv/ fidworins tigauns jah fimf(a)ins þusonddjiw jah dwauddje haund(dj)e jah ainiwe "45,211 (acc)"

gothic numerals
the larger these numbers get, of course, the less likely a middle gothic writer would be to write the words out in full. instead, they used gothic numerals, which functioned similar to greek numerals: the letters of the alphabet were each given a particular numerical value, and then written in an additive fashion. for example, n has a value of 50 and z has a value of 7, so nz indicates 57. to avoid confusion with running text, numerals were either separated out by periods ( .nz. ) or by writing an overline above the numeral. the values are:
Letterabgdeqzhþiklmnjup*rstwfxƕo*
Value123456789102030405060708090100200300400500600700800900
where asterisks indicate characters only used as numerals, not as letters

for numbers larger than 999, a variety of schemes were used, mostly consisting of various symbols written above or below the characters
Last edited by Emily on Sun Aug 20, 2023 4:02 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Modern Gothic

Post by Emily »

evmdbm wrote: Tue Aug 15, 2023 6:15 am
Emily wrote: Fri Aug 11, 2023 12:45 am lastly, below is the indefinite article ains; the competing indefinite article saums declines exactly the same except with the stem /sɔm-/ instead of /ɛn-/
When do you use ains as opposed to saums or vice versa?
some of it is dialectal variation: one dialect may favor ains while another prefers saums. when a given text does make a distinction, however, saums would be more commonly used to introduce a subject that would continue to be referred back to (i.e. a subject that would go on to require definite articles), and ains would be more commonly used for one-off subjects, or to emphasize that its referent was alone or different in some way
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Re: Modern Gothic

Post by hwhatting »

in both sentences "men" is genitive.
I assume genitive plural, like in Slavic?
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Re: Modern Gothic

Post by Emily »

hwhatting wrote: Sun Aug 20, 2023 8:16 am
in both sentences "men" is genitive.
I assume genitive plural, like in Slavic?
correct
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Re: Modern Gothic

Post by Moose-tache »

I like that Gothic is mostly pretty standard and predictable, with a targeted set of oddities, like the preservation of the dual. It feels naturalistic while still being creative and weird.
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Re: Modern Gothic

Post by Emily »

thank you! phases 2 and 3 get a little weirder but i'm trying to still have naturalistic order brought to the chaos. like things can get complicated, but the speakers still need to be able to remember how everything works lol
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Re: Modern Gothic

Post by Emily »

verbs (phase one—middle gothic)
like old gothic and most other early germanic languages, middle gothic has two basic classes of verbs: "strong" verbs and "weak" verbs. officially they are distinguished from each other by their endings, but the most striking difference is of course the changes to the stem undergone by most strong verbs

strong verbs
most of the classes of strong verbs (all but class 7) demonstrate vowel alternations in the word stem. there are four parts to the vowel alternations: 1) the vowel of the citation form, found in the infinitive, the present tenses, the imperative mood, and the present participle; 2) "past 1", found in the indicative past singular; 3) "past 2", found in the indicative past dual and plural, and throughout the subjunctive past; and 4) the past participle (which is always the same as either the citation form or past 2). the classes, with these vowels indicated in order, are:
  • class 1a: a a a a
  • class 1b: a aʊaa a
  • class 2: a ɔʊ u u
  • class 3a: a ɛʊ i i
  • class 3b: a ɛʊ ɛ ɛ
  • class 4: i a a i
  • class 5: i a u u
  • class 6: u ɔ a u
the vowel alternations and endings are best illustrated with the class 5 verb /bíndan/ "to bind":
More: show
Indicative active present
Num1st2nd3rd
Sgbíndabíndɛsbíndɛþ
Dubíndosbíndats
Plbíndambíndɛþbíndand
Indicative active past
Num1st2nd3rd
Sgbándbánst*bánd
Dubúndɔbúndɔts
Plbúndɔmbúndɔþbúndɔm
* the 2sg ind act past ending is /t/ after a voiceless consonant and /d/ after a voiced consonant or a vowel, unless the root itself ends in /t/ or /d/ in which case the final consonant and the ending combine to form /st/ as shown above

Indicative passive present
Num1st2nd3rd
Sgbíndaðbíndazbíndað
Du
Plbíndandbíndandbíndand
Subjunctive active present
Num1st2nd3rd
Sgbíndɔsbíndɛsbíndɛ
Dubíndɛvbíndɛts
Plbíndɛmbíndɛþbíndɛn
Subjunctive active past
Num1st2nd3rd
Sgbúɲʤɔbúɲʤisbúɲʤɛ
Dubúɲʤivbúɲʤits
Plbúɲʤimbúɲʤiþbúɲʤin
Subjunctive passive present
Num1st2nd3rd
Sgbíndɛðbíndɛzbíndɛð
Du
Plbíndɛndbíndɛndbíndɛnd
Imperative
Num1st2nd3rd
Sgbíndbíndað
Dubíndats
Plbíndambíndɛþbíndand
  • infinitive: bíndan
  • present participle: bíndandz
  • past participle: búndanz
the last class of strong verbs, reduplicating verbs (class 7), features a reduplicated prefix in the past tenses (both indicative and subjunctive) rather than vowel alternation. (there were some reduplicating verbs in old gothic that featured vowel alternation as well, but this was lost due in middle gothic due to sound changes.) the prefix consists of the first consonant of the verb followed by /ɛ/: /mɛ́ʊta/ "I carve", /mɛmɛ́ʊt/ "I carved". if the root begins with one of the clusters /sk st sʦ ʃʧ zg zd zʣ zʤ/, that cluster is reduplicated; otherwise, only the first consonant is repeated: /skɛ́ʊðand/ "they separate" -> /skɛskɛ́ʊðɔm/ "they separated", but /ðrɛ́ʊsand/ "they goad, bully" -> /ðɛðrɛ́ʊsɔm/ "they goaded, bullied". a verb that starts with a vowel simply has /ɛ/ as a prefix. (there seems to be debate as to whether the stress stayed with the root in reduplicated verbs or whether it moved to the reduplicated prefix; the above description is based on the assumption that it stayed on the root, but i want to play around with what it might look like if it moved to the reduplicated prefix instead)

weak verbs
weak verbs feature no vowel alternation (with a few irregular exceptions) and no reduplication. in contrast to the numerous subclasses of strong verbs, middle gothic only has two weak verb classes

the conjugational endings for class 1 weak verbs are similar to those of strong verbs, differing only in the past tenses, in the 2sg imperative, and in the past participle. the past tenses generally feature the infix -ɛð- or -ɛʒ-, and similarly the past participle ends in -ɛþ. class 2 weak verbs have similar endings to class 1, but most of the vowels are changed to -o-; they derive primarily from old gothic class 2 weak verbs, and secondarily from other weak verbs (and sometimes strong verbs) with labialized final consonants. examples of each:

class 1: hawan /hávan/ "to have"
More: show
Indicative active present
Num1st2nd3rd
Sghávahávɛshávɛþ
Duhávoshávats
Plhávamhávɛþhávand
Indicative active past
Num1st2nd3rd
Sghávɛðhávɛʒeshávɛð
Duhávɛʒeðhávɛðɔts
Plhávɛðɔmhávɛðɔþhávɛðɔm
Indicative passive present
Num1st2nd3rd
Sghávaðhávazhávað
Du
Plhávandhávandhávand
Subjunctive active present
Num1st2nd3rd
Sghávɔhávɛshávɛ
Duhávɛvhávɛts
Plhávɛmhávɛþhávɛn
Subjunctive active past
Num1st2nd3rd
Sghávɛʒhávɛʒishávɛʒ
Duhávɛʒivhávɛʒits
Plhávɛʒimhávɛʒiþhávɛʒin
Subjunctive passive present
Num1st2nd3rd
Sghávɛðhávɛzhávɛð
Du
Plhávɛndhávɛndhávɛnd
Imperative
Num1st2nd3rd
Sghávɛhávað
Duhávats
Plhávamhávɛþhávand
  • infinitive: hávan
  • present participle: hávandz
  • past participle: hávɛþs
class 2: kaupon /kɔ́ʊpon/ "to make a deal, bargain"
More: show
Indicative active present
Num1st2nd3rd
Sgkɔ́ʊpokɔ́ʊposkɔ́ʊpoþ
Dukɔ́ʊposkɔ́ʊpots
Plkɔ́ʊpomkɔ́ʊpoþkɔ́ʊpond
Indicative active past
Num1st2nd3rd
Sgkɔ́ʊpoðkɔ́ʊpoʒeskɔ́ʊpoð
Dukɔ́ʊpoʒeðkɔ́ʊpoðɔts
Plkɔ́ʊpoðɔmkɔ́ʊpoðɔþkɔ́ʊpoðɔm
Indicative passive present
Num1st2nd3rd
Sgkɔ́ʊpoðkɔ́ʊpozkɔ́ʊpoð
Du
Plkɔ́ʊpondkɔ́ʊpondkɔ́ʊpond
Subjunctive active present
Num1st2nd3rd
Sgkɔ́ʊpɔkɔ́ʊposkɔ́ʊpo
Dukɔ́ʊpovkɔ́ʊpots
Plkɔ́ʊpomkɔ́ʊpoþkɔ́ʊpon
Subjunctive active past
Num1st2nd3rd
Sgkɔ́ʊpoʒkɔ́ʊpoʒiskɔ́ʊpoʒ
Dukɔ́ʊpoʒivkɔ́ʊpoʒits
Plkɔ́ʊpoʒimkɔ́ʊpoʒiþkɔ́ʊpoʒin
Subjunctive passive present
Num1st2nd3rd
Sgkɔ́ʊpoðkɔ́ʊpozkɔ́ʊpoð
Du
Plkɔ́ʊpondkɔ́ʊpondkɔ́ʊpond
Imperative
Num1st2nd3rd
Sgkɔ́ʊpokɔ́ʊpoð
Dukɔ́ʊpots
Plkɔ́ʊpomkɔ́ʊpoþkɔ́ʊpond
  • infinitive: kɔ́ʊpon
  • present participle: kɔ́ʊpondz
  • past participle: kɔ́ʊpoþs

copula
unsurprisingly, the middle gothic copula wusan /vúsan/ is highly irregular, enough so to warrant its own section. most indicative forms have different stressed and unstressed variants; subjunctive forms derive from old gothic unstressed subjunctives; and imperiative forms derive from old gothic stressed subjunctives. there are no passive forms. they are listed in the table below (with stressed and unstressed variants listed where applicable):
More: show
Indicative present
Num1st2nd3rd
Sgím / ɛmís / ɛsíst / ɛst
Duʃíjɔ / ʃɛjʃíjɔts / ʃɛjɔts
Plʃíjɔm / ʃɛjɔmʃíjɔþ / ʃɛjɔþʃínd / ʃɛnd
Indicative past
Num1st2nd3rd
Sgvɔ́s / vɔsvɔ́st / vɔstvɔ́s / vɔs
Duvwásɔ / vosvwásɔts / vosɔts
Plvwásɔm / vosɔmvwásɔþ / vosɔþvwásɔn / vosɔn
Subjunctive present
Num1st2nd3rd
Sgʃɛjʃɛjɛsʃɛj
Duʃɛjɛvʃɛjɛts
Plʃɛjɛmʃɛjɛþʃɛjɛn
Subjunctive past
Num1st2nd3rd
Sgvoʃvoʃisvoʃ
Duvoʃivvoʃits
Plvoʃimvoʃiþvoʃin
Imperative
Num1st2nd3rd
Sgʃíjɛsʃíjɛ
Duʃíjɛts
Plʃíjɛmʃíjɛþʃíjɛn
  • infinitive: vúsan
  • present participle: vúsandz
  • past participle: vúsanz
there are many contractions of pronouns with corresponding forms of the copula: /ik im/ -> /ɛʦɛm/ "I am", /þu is/ -> /þys/ "thou art", /fɔs ist/ -> /fɔʃɛst/ "who is", /is þu/ -> /ɛsþ/ "art thou", etc.

participles
the present participle is mostly found in attributive form, but is sometimes used in the predicate to indicate progressive aspect (though only to a limited degree—think spanish usage, not english). there aren't separate weak or strong versions of the present participle. instead, its declension is mostly the same as weak adjectives, except the masc nom sg declension is /-z/ like strong adjectives, and feminine endings palatalize the final consonant and replace the vowel in the ending with /-i-/ (/haldaɲʤ/, /haldaɲʤim/, /haldaɲʤinz/, etc.)

the past participle, in contrast, declines strong or weak as any other adjective does. the past participles of intransitive verbs generally have active meaning and those of transitive verbs generally have a passive meaning. the past participle is also used to form periphrastic passives [old gothic used both wisan "to be" and waírþan "to become" for this; i haven't decided which i prefer for middle gothic]
Ælfwine
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Re: Modern Gothic

Post by Ælfwine »

I also worked on a Modern Gothic descendant, except I derived it from what is known of crimean gothic. So I'm interested to see where this goes.
hwhatting wrote: Tue Aug 08, 2023 4:49 am You're very cautious here; AFAIK most people who accept the source call it Crimean Gothic and assume that it's a descendant of Wulfila's Gothic.
Minor quibble: some scholars accept its not a descendant of Biblical or Wulfila's Gothic, but rather a sister language to it. It lacks some of the innovations present in BG, like lowering i and u before /r/. I'm not sure who accepts it as a descendant of BG. Some believe its a descendant of West Germanic, but I don't find that any more convincing.
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Emily
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Re: Modern Gothic

Post by Emily »

nouns (phase two—early modern gothic)
one of the most distinctive sound changes between phases 1 and 2 is the nasalization and subsequent denasalization of vowels. among other effects, this led to the loss of a distinction between strong and weak nouns, since the nasal consonants that defined the latter were lost. other declensions merged as well, leaving six major declensions in phase 2 (plus one more consisting only of "sister", "brother", "daughter", and related compounds). which ph2 declension a particular ph1 declension went into was sometimes based on its final consonant; a couple of declensions additionally went one way for most words, but a different way if a given word in that declension was more commonly used in its plural form. the full descent list:
More: show
middle gothic declensionenvironmentearly modern gothic declension
strong 1/consonant/-ndanydecl 1
strong 2anydecl 2
strong 3final consonant is /-j/ or /-ɲ/decl 2
strong 3/strong 5/weak 2/weak 3final consonant is not /-j/ or /-ɲ/decl 3
strong 4/weak 1anydecl 4
weak 3final consonant is /-j/ or /-ɲ/decl 4
strong 5/weak 3final consonant is not /-j/ or /-ɲ/ and plural form is particularly commondecl 4
weak 4anydecl 5
strong 5/weak 2final consonant is /-j/ or /-ɲ/decl 5
strong 6anydecl 6
minor Ranyminor R
and the inflectional endings:
More: show
Declension 1
CaseSgPl
Noms/z*ʊs
Acc–**ɔz
Datɛɔ
Genʲɛsʲɪ
Declension 2
CaseSgPl
Noms/z*ʲɪs
Acc–**ʲɔz
Datɛʲɔ
Genʲɛsʲɪ
Declension 3
CaseSgPl
NomʊsJʊs
Accʊɔz
Datɛɔ
Genʲʊsʲɛv
Declension 4
CaseSgPl
Nomɛʊs
Accɔʊs
Datɛɔ
Genʲʊsʲoj
Declension 5
CaseSgPl
Nomɪɪz
Accɪɪz
Datɛɔ
Genʲɪzʲɪ
Declension 6
CaseSgPl
Nom–**ɛ
Acc–**ɛ
Datɛɔ
Genʲɛsʲɪ
Declension R
CaseSgPl
Nomɛrʲʊs
Accɛrʲɔz
Datʲɔ
Genʲʊrzʲɪ
* /ɛs/ after a palatal, or after /s/ or /z/
* /ɛ/ after a palatal
most declensions ended up with /-ɛ/ and /-ɔ/ for dat sg and dat pl; these forms were spread to the remaining declensions by analogy. additionally, in a minority of texts, declension 3 nouns are sometimes encountered with <j> in the oblique plural forms, spread from nom pl, though this is not particularly common. finally, a number of nouns replaced the inherited final consonant in the nom sg and acc sg forms with that of the oblique declensions (most commonly this was a newly voiced final consonant replacing an earlier voiceless one), though there are a number of irregular nouns that retain their consonant variation

examples with real words (most of which are descendants of those in the ph1 post for the sake of comparison):
More: show
Declension 1 — bardz "beard"
CaseSgPl
Nombárdzbárdʊs
Accbárdbárdɔz
Datbárdɛbárdɔ
Genbáʒɛsbáʒɪ
Declension 2 — lefks "festival"
CaseSgPl
Nomléf(k)sléfsɪs
Accléfkléfsɔz
Datléfkɛléfsɔ
Genléfsɛsléfsɪ
Strong 3 — amus "village"
CaseSgPl
Nomámʊsámjʊs
Accámʊámɔz
Datámɛámɔ
Genámʊsámjɛv
Strong 4 — zilþz "sickle"
CaseSgPl
Nomzílðɛzílðʊs
Acczílðɔzílðʊs
Datzílðɛzílðɔ
Genzíʒʊszíʒɔj
Strong 5 — efsji "mother"
CaseSgPl
Noméfʃɪéfʃɪz
Accéfʃɪéfʃɪz
Datéfʃɛéfʃɔ
Genéfʃɪzéfʃɪ
Strong 6 — kan "grain"
CaseSgPl
Nomkánkánɛ
Acckánkánɛ
Datkánɛkánɔ
Genkájɛskájɪ
(bwoþ, the reflex of ph1 boþ "blood" falls into this declension, but it is irregular, with the form /bvóþ/ in the nom sg and nom pl and the stems /bdóð-/ or /bvóʒ-/ in the rest of the declension)

Minor R — wuster "sister"
CaseSgPl
Nomvústɛrvúʃtʊs
Accvústɛrvúʃtɔz
Datvústrɛvúʃtɔ
Genvúʃʧʊrzvúʃtɪ
it should be noted that polysyllabic roots generally have the stress on the penultimate syllable of the word, not the stem, which can lead to stress shifts within a given root: bwostewz /bvóstɛvz/ "letter of the alphabet (nom sg)" vs bwostewe /bvɔstévɛ/ (dat sg)

again, the vocative almost always matches the accusative in the singular and the nominative in the plural
Last edited by Emily on Thu Nov 30, 2023 12:30 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Emily
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Re: Modern Gothic

Post by Emily »

alphabet and spelling
all phases of gothic are written with the gothic alphabet traditionally attributed to wulfila; the text presented in this thread is of course a transliteration. a description of the spelling and pronunciation of old gothic can be found elsewhere; this post of course is concerned with the orthography of later phases

phase one (middle gothic)
one immediately distinct change made in middle gothic orthography is the introduction of spaces between words (which is generally present in academic transliteration of old gothic text but absent in the original texts themselves). middle gothic spelling strikes an uneasy balance between maintaining old gothic spelling principles and the actual spellings of old gothic words. an example of the former is the middle gothic ending /-ɔs/, found (among other places) in the nom sg of declension-3 strong nouns. many of these words descend from old gothic words ending in -us /-us/, but sound changes altered the vowel, and by middle gothic they are spelled -aus, dutifully reflecting the old gothic use of au for /ɔ(ː)/. similarly, middle gothic /ɛ/ is usually written ai

many spellings, however, ignore sound changes and retain earlier spellings. this is starkest in the stressed vowels: ai can stand for /ɛ́/ or /ɛ́ʊ/, au for /ɔ́/ or /ɔ́ʊ/, and a for /á/ or /áʊ/. similarly, the decision to write d or þ for /ð/ is based largely on etymology. middle gothic /já/, likewise, descends from multiple sources, and is generally spelled according to its origins: ja from old gothic ja, iu from old gothic iu, and ei in most other instances

other spellings of note:
  • w indicates /v/ even when it descends from earlier /b/
  • g generally continues to indicate [ŋ]
  • as indicated above, [já] can be spelled ja, iu, or ei (very occasionally e)
  • [wá] is always spelled o even if it descends from earlier /uː/
  • palatalized consonants usually retain their pre-palatalization spelling, typically with a following j, e, or i (/ɛ/ following a palatalized consonant is usually written i, in contrast to its typical spelling ai)
  • however, /ʤ/ is nearly always spelled ddj, or dj at the beginning of a word
  • leveled voicing is unevenly indicated: stops usually indicate the new pronunciation, fricatives only sometimes, and /s/ and /z/ very rarely
  • the letter ƕ is only used in interrogative pronouns descended from earlier [hʷ], and even then only if it's pronounced /f/
  • the letter q is only used in descendants of old gothic qēns "wife", qinō "woman", qiþan "to say, speak", qiman "to come"
  • the letter x is only found in descendants and derivates of xristus "Christ", and occasionally in liturgical words or given names descended from greek
phase two (early modern gothic)
by early modern gothic, the sound system had changed so drastically that to continue earlier spelling rules would be extremely unwieldly, and the general spelling system was greatly simplified. this predated the introduction of printing to eastern europe, but was certainly cemented by it. the vowels by this point had settled into five phonemes, and were written accordingly: a e i o u. the consonant [ŋ] was lost, and with it the convention for spelling it g; when it was reintroduced as a new phoneme, it was spelled n before a velar consonant and ng otherwise. the use of þ vs d for /ð/ continues to largely be etymological, although it is usually written þ when adjacent to a voiced consonant. the phone [h] was lost but [x] remained, still spelled h; when [h] returned, as the reflex of earlier [ɣ], it came to be spelled h as well (though this took a while to be cemented, with the alternate spelling g appearing fairly frequently for several centuries)

an important note is that the palatal(ized) consonants are written as pronounced, regardless of how they alternate with other consonants: /ʃ/ is always sj, and /ʒ/ is always zj (except in the clusters /ʃt/ and /ʒd/, which are stj and zdj). this leads to stark variations in spelling: midus /míðʊs/ "alcoholic drink" (nom sg) vs mizjus /míʒʊs/ (nom pl). this also compounds the ambiguity of /s z/, which may be plain consonants in their own right with palatal forms /ʃ ʒ/, but can also be palatalized forms of /k g/

lastly, the letters ƕ q x began to be reintroduced into words they had formerly appeared in, though in this stage this reintroduction does not go very far

phase three (modern gothic)
the development of early modern gothic into thoroughly modern gothic was marked by a number of sound changes, and the spelling inconsistently indicated or ignored these changes. sound changes that are generally reflected in modern spelling:
  • the loss of post-vocalic /l/
  • the shift of certain diphthongs into monophthongs (/aj/ > /e/, /au eu/ > /o/, etc.), though not the shift of falling diphthongs to rising diphthongs (e.g. /wi/ continues to be written oj or uj)
  • vowel hiatus simplification (except when it leads to former vowels turning into semivowels; these are still written with the letter for the earlier vowel, as indicated in the table below)
  • the collapse of consonant + unstressed vowel + same consonant into just the consonant (e.g. unstressed /kɪk/, /mæm/ becoming /k/, /m/)
  • a stop assimilating to a preceding nasal consonant's point of articulation
additionally, the deletion of an unstressed vowel in word initial C_CV is inconsistently indicated, as are the changes listed under "consonant cluster simplification". all other phase 3 sound changes are generally not indicated

most confusingly for the learner of modern gothic, each of the five vowel letters can indicate several different sounds depending on the word. as described in the post on sound changes, an originally allophonic shift of stressed vowels in open syllables becomes morphemic due mostly to paradigm leveling, with "shifted" forms alternating with non-shifted forms. additionally, word-initial stressed vowels developed opening glides which are generally not written. this leads to the somewhat bewildering set of pronunciations for each vowel letter:
More: show
Variantaeiouiuoj/ujou
Stressed (non-initial)áéíóú
Stressed (initial)
Stressed and shifted (non-initial)áuáéɑ́ówó
Stressed and shifted (initial)wɑ́
Unstressedæɛɪɔʊ
Unstressed (final syllable)əɨɨəə
Semivowelwjjwwn/an/an/a

the most distinctive change from early modern spelling is the spelling of palatals. palatal consonants are written to be consistent throughout a paradigm, and between related words, whenever possible: midus /méðəs/ "liquor" (nom sg) vs midjus /méʒəs/ (nom pl). outside of paradigmatic alternation, the palatal consonants /ʃ ʒ/ are spelled etymologically where possible. old gothic words that have palatalized to /s z j/ that don't alternate with non-palatalized forms are generally just spelled s z j, with the most notable exceptions being xrjistus (see below) and the word rjigo /jéɟə/ "rain" (from old gothic rign)

this period also sees a much wider-spread reintroduction of ƕ q x into reflexes of old gothic words that contained them. due to sound changes, ƕ is usually /f/, sometimes /v/, and q is generally /k/ or /g/ (as is x, though in this case it reflects the old gothic pronunciation). the reintroduction is sometimes not etymologically accurate, the most famous case being qwos "cow" from old gothic *kūs. the letters q and x can also be affected by palatalization; a distinctive example of this is xrjistus /sístəs/ "Christ"

possible changes
in each phase, the spelling of /ð/ is either d and þ, the choice of which largely depends on etymology. i'm not entirely happy with this, and i've been toying with the idea of them pressing another unused letter into service, either 𐍁 or 𐍊. these letters were not used in spelling gothic words, only in writing numbers, and represented 90 and 900 respectively. my instinct is to use the 900 glyph, as the shape is reminiscent of T, which feels appropriate for a dental consonant; however, the 90 glyph also has a visual similarity to the gothic þ glyph 𐌸. either way, if i do end up going this route, the use of the letter would be introduced in early modern gothic as part of the broader reimagining of spelling that took place in that era

secondly, all of this assumes a direct, unchanged continuation of the original forms of the letters themselves. i admit this assumption was mostly due to laziness on my part, but i've been reconsidering my approach, and may try to develop an internal history of the letter forms themselves. it's certainly not unreasonable to expect them to have developed a distinction between capital and lowercase, for example, as both the greek script (which gothic letters are based on) and cyrillic script (which is used by the cultures the modern goths find themselves surrounded by) developed this distinction. if i were to look at evolving the letters to a different set of forms today, this might also include forming diacritics, especially one that would replace the current j used to indicate palatalization. like i said, however, these are just thoughts, and i haven't made any actual progress on any of this
Travis B.
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Re: Modern Gothic

Post by Travis B. »

Emily wrote: Sat Nov 25, 2023 7:10 pm possible changes
in each phase, the spelling of /ð/ is either d and þ, the choice of which largely depends on etymology. i'm not entirely happy with this, and i've been toying with the idea of them pressing another unused letter into service, either 𐍁 or 𐍊. these letters were not used in spelling gothic words, only in writing numbers, and represented 90 and 900 respectively. my instinct is to use the 900 glyph, as the shape is reminiscent of T, which feels appropriate for a dental consonant; however, the 90 glyph also has a visual similarity to the gothic þ glyph 𐌸. either way, if i do end up going this route, the use of the letter would be introduced in early modern gothic as part of the broader reimagining of spelling that took place in that era
I personally actually prefer using ⟨d⟩ versus ⟨þ⟩ etymologically here, whereas using ⟨𐍁⟩, ⟨𐍊⟩ or ⟨𐌸⟩ for /ð/, even if it makes for a more regular orthography, seem less satisfying to me for some reason.
Yaaludinuya siima d'at yiseka ha wohadetafa gaare.
Ennadinutha gaare d'ate ha eetatadi siiman.
T'awraa t'awraa t'awraa t'awraa t'awraa t'awraa t'awraa.
sasasha
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Re: Modern Gothic

Post by sasasha »

Emily wrote: Sat Nov 25, 2023 5:15 pm Minor R — wuster "sister"
CaseSgPl
Nomvústɛrvúʃtʊs
Accvústɛrvúʃtɔz
Datvústrɛvúʃtɔ
Genzvúʃʧʊrzvúʃtɪ
I'm guessing the z- in the genitive singular isn't supposed to be there (though I'd be intrigued if it was).

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Emily
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Re: Modern Gothic

Post by Emily »

sasasha wrote: Wed Nov 29, 2023 6:23 pm
Emily wrote: Sat Nov 25, 2023 5:15 pm Minor R — wuster "sister"
CaseSgPl
Nomvústɛrvúʃtʊs
Accvústɛrvúʃtɔz
Datvústrɛvúʃtɔ
Genzvúʃʧʊrzvúʃtɪ
I'm guessing the z- in the genitive singular isn't supposed to be there (though I'd be intrigued if it was).
good catch!
I'm enjoying this project!
thank you!
Civil War Bugle
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Re: Modern Gothic

Post by Civil War Bugle »

I feel like I am always tempted by these sorts of alt-germanic languages.
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